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Thread: Daniel Jeremiah 2020 mock draft 1.0 - 4 QBs in top 15

  1. #81
    Stupid + Scared = Carrbage

  2. #82
    I think the no heart & balls factors greatly into what we see from Carr..you can't extend plays from the Fetal position..he is what he is!

  3. #83
    Quote Originally Posted by mstrbass2000 View Post
    russell wilson scored a 28 and is below the avg of other super bowl qbs is he the outlier on wonderlic
    Scoring slightly below average doesnít make him an outlier. An outlier would be a number which falls outside of a confidence interval which Iím sure youíd understand since youíre a math guy.

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorRaider View Post
    Scoring slightly below average doesn’t make him an outlier. An outlier would be a number which falls outside of a confidence interval which I’m sure you’d understand since you’re a math guy.
    so mahomes with a 24 if the chief wins

  5. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by mstrbass2000 View Post
    so mahomes with a 24 if the chief wins
    Mathematically sure, but I mentioned a score below 23 earlier because below 23 is considered below average for the QB position as a whole. I believe the QB with the lowest score to win a Super Bowl in recent history is Ben Roethlisberger and he scored a 25. (in hindsight below 24 would be considered below average, and Mahomes is still at/above that threshold)

    Every year we have the same debate — do Wonderlic scores matter? It’s typically the debate that comes after — do forty times matter and do verticals matter and do heights and weights matter? That’s because the NFL made the poor decision not to release all Wonderlic scores at the combine. The result is these scores, unlike the physical combine data that is immediately released in late February, come out in a slow trickle as the NFL Draft nears.

    If you’re not aware the Wonderlic is a 12 minute test featuring 50 questions that is scored on a scale from 1-50. If you’re interested in taking your own test you can do so here.

    While the Wonderlic isn’t perfect for all positions — no type of testing is — the Wonderlic 100% matters for quarterbacks. Indeed, the Super Bowl winning quarterbacks currently playing in the NFL have posted an average Wonderlic score of 30.7 over the past generation of football. You can see all those quarterback Wonderlics below in a chart I put together.

    So for anyone out there arguing that Wonderlic doesn’t matter at all, isn’t it wild that only quarterbacks who have scored in the top half or above of quarterback test takers have won Super Bowls?

    In general your Wonderlic score will correlate with your SAT, ACT, LSAT, MCAT or GRE scores. If you do well on those tests you will do well on the Wonderlic, if you do poorly, you will do poorly on the Wonderlic. If you’ve taken any of those tests, as I’m sure most of you have, you’re aware that the test isn’t perfect. For instance, standardized tests don’t measure work ethic, communication skills, creativity, emotional intelligence or many other factors that have a great deal to do with success in all manner of working life. But these tests are useful measures of intelligence. (And, no, they are not biased. Not unless you believe that Asian people, who consistently dominate standardized tests in this country, have taken the test industry hostage and are skewing all results to their benefit.)



    My position on the Wonderlic is simple, I believe that all combine measurement scores, physical and mental, are important tools that allow teams to compare individual prospects against each other and against several years of game film. Some teams use the combine data on the Wonderlic a great deal — the Patriots, for instance, consistently draft players that score highly on the Wonderlic — and other teams do not.

    That’s their choice as a talent evaluator.

    But I believe if we are going to praise players for how fast and strong they are, shouldn’t we also weigh that with their intelligence? I would release all physical and mental data from the combine instead of excluding the Wonderlic from public release. After all, shouldn’t everyone’s kids aspire to be like Texas A&M defensive end Myles Garrett, a physical freak on the football field and in the classroom too, who is in line to be the number one overall pick? In fact, if anything, Garrett’s intelligence has been underplayed all three seasons at Texas A&M while everyone has focused on his physical gifts. We all know that former Tennessee quarterback Josh Dobbs is studying to be an astrophysicist. Well, Dobbs scored a 29 on the Wonderlic, Garrett got a 31.

    On the flip side, last week the fact that Leonard Fournette, Dalvin Cook, and Joe Mixon all tested 12 or lower was publicly released. Those scores are so low that all three players are borderline illiterate. That is, assuming they did their best on the tests — and why wouldn’t you do your best if you’re interviewing for a job, if you don’t do your best that tells me a ton — all three guys posted lower test scores than your average janitor.

    That doesn’t mean that all three men will be unsuccessful at running back, although it does raise serious questions about how they managed to stay eligible for three or four seasons at Oklahoma, Florida State, and LSU. If these guys can barely read, how in the world did they complete college level course work without others doing the work for them? That’s why I believe academic fraud is rampant on college campus when it comes to big time athletics.

    Here’s a guide to the average scores that different professions post on the Wonderlic:

    Systems analyst ‚€“ 32
    Chemist ‚€“ 31
    Electrical engineer ‚€“ 30
    Engineer ‚€“ 29
    Programmer ‚€“ 29
    Accountant ‚€“ 28
    Executive ‚€“ 28
    Reporter ‚€“ 28
    Teacher ‚€“ 28
    Copywriter ‚€“ 27
    Investment analyst ‚€“ 27
    Librarian ‚€“ 27
    Electronics technician ‚€“ 26
    Salesperson ‚€“ 25
    Secretary ‚€“ 24
    Dispatcher ‚€“ 23

    Bank teller ‚€“ 22

    Cashier ‚€“ 21
    Firefighter ‚€“ 21
    Clerical worker ‚€“ 21
    Machinist ‚€“ 21
    Receptionist ‚€“ 21
    Train conductor ‚€“ 21
    Craftsman ‚€“ 18
    Security guard ‚€“ 17
    Welder ‚€“ 17
    Warehouseman ‚€“ 15
    Janitor ‚€“ 14

    And here are the average scores of different NFL positions:

    Offensive tackle ‚€“ 26
    Center ‚€“ 25
    Quarterback ‚€“ 24
    Guard ‚€“ 23
    Tight end ‚€“ 22
    Safety ‚€“ 19
    Linebacker ‚€“ 19
    Cornerback ‚€“ 18
    Wide receiver ‚€“ 17
    Fullback ‚€“ 17
    Halfback ‚€“ 16

    And here are the present Super Bowl winning quarterbacks currently active in the NFL and their Wonderlic scores:

    Eli Manning 39

    Aaron Rodgers 35

    Tom Brady 33

    Drew Brees 28

    Russell Wilson 28

    Joe Flacco 27

    Ben Roethlisberger 25

    This means the average Super Bowl winning quarterback scored a 30.7. (That’s not counting Brady’s 33 five times or Eli Manning’s 39 twice either. If you did that the average score bumps up to 32.3)

    That’s statistically significant.


    Feel free to take a sample wonderlic: https://footballiqscore.com/
    Last edited by DoctorRaider; 01-24-2020 at 09:14 AM.

  6. #86
    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorRaider View Post
    Mathematically sure, but I mentioned a score below 23 earlier because below 23 is considered below average for the QB position as a whole. I believe the QB with the lowest score to win a Super Bowl in recent history is Ben Roethlisberger and he scored a 25. (in hindsight below 24 would be considered below average, and Mahomes is still at/above that threshold)

    Every year we have the same debate — do Wonderlic scores matter? It’s typically the debate that comes after — do forty times matter and do verticals matter and do heights and weights matter? That’s because the NFL made the poor decision not to release all Wonderlic scores at the combine. The result is these scores, unlike the physical combine data that is immediately released in late February, come out in a slow trickle as the NFL Draft nears.

    If you’re not aware the Wonderlic is a 12 minute test featuring 50 questions that is scored on a scale from 1-50. If you’re interested in taking your own test you can do so here.

    While the Wonderlic isn’t perfect for all positions — no type of testing is — the Wonderlic 100% matters for quarterbacks. Indeed, the Super Bowl winning quarterbacks currently playing in the NFL have posted an average Wonderlic score of 30.7 over the past generation of football. You can see all those quarterback Wonderlics below in a chart I put together.

    So for anyone out there arguing that Wonderlic doesn’t matter at all, isn’t it wild that only quarterbacks who have scored in the top half or above of quarterback test takers have won Super Bowls?

    In general your Wonderlic score will correlate with your SAT, ACT, LSAT, MCAT or GRE scores. If you do well on those tests you will do well on the Wonderlic, if you do poorly, you will do poorly on the Wonderlic. If you’ve taken any of those tests, as I’m sure most of you have, you’re aware that the test isn’t perfect. For instance, standardized tests don’t measure work ethic, communication skills, creativity, emotional intelligence or many other factors that have a great deal to do with success in all manner of working life. But these tests are useful measures of intelligence. (And, no, they are not biased. Not unless you believe that Asian people, who consistently dominate standardized tests in this country, have taken the test industry hostage and are skewing all results to their benefit.)



    My position on the Wonderlic is simple, I believe that all combine measurement scores, physical and mental, are important tools that allow teams to compare individual prospects against each other and against several years of game film. Some teams use the combine data on the Wonderlic a great deal — the Patriots, for instance, consistently draft players that score highly on the Wonderlic — and other teams do not.

    That’s their choice as a talent evaluator.

    But I believe if we are going to praise players for how fast and strong they are, shouldn’t we also weigh that with their intelligence? I would release all physical and mental data from the combine instead of excluding the Wonderlic from public release. After all, shouldn’t everyone’s kids aspire to be like Texas A&M defensive end Myles Garrett, a physical freak on the football field and in the classroom too, who is in line to be the number one overall pick? In fact, if anything, Garrett’s intelligence has been underplayed all three seasons at Texas A&M while everyone has focused on his physical gifts. We all know that former Tennessee quarterback Josh Dobbs is studying to be an astrophysicist. Well, Dobbs scored a 29 on the Wonderlic, Garrett got a 31.

    On the flip side, last week the fact that Leonard Fournette, Dalvin Cook, and Joe Mixon all tested 12 or lower was publicly released. Those scores are so low that all three players are borderline illiterate. That is, assuming they did their best on the tests — and why wouldn’t you do your best if you’re interviewing for a job, if you don’t do your best that tells me a ton — all three guys posted lower test scores than your average janitor.

    That doesn’t mean that all three men will be unsuccessful at running back, although it does raise serious questions about how they managed to stay eligible for three or four seasons at Oklahoma, Florida State, and LSU. If these guys can barely read, how in the world did they complete college level course work without others doing the work for them? That’s why I believe academic fraud is rampant on college campus when it comes to big time athletics.

    Here’s a guide to the average scores that different professions post on the Wonderlic:

    Systems analyst ‚€“ 32
    Chemist ‚€“ 31
    Electrical engineer ‚€“ 30
    Engineer ‚€“ 29
    Programmer ‚€“ 29
    Accountant ‚€“ 28
    Executive ‚€“ 28
    Reporter ‚€“ 28
    Teacher ‚€“ 28
    Copywriter ‚€“ 27
    Investment analyst ‚€“ 27
    Librarian ‚€“ 27
    Electronics technician ‚€“ 26
    Salesperson ‚€“ 25
    Secretary ‚€“ 24
    Dispatcher ‚€“ 23

    Bank teller ‚€“ 22

    Cashier ‚€“ 21
    Firefighter ‚€“ 21
    Clerical worker ‚€“ 21
    Machinist ‚€“ 21
    Receptionist ‚€“ 21
    Train conductor ‚€“ 21
    Craftsman ‚€“ 18
    Security guard ‚€“ 17
    Welder ‚€“ 17
    Warehouseman ‚€“ 15
    Janitor ‚€“ 14

    And here are the average scores of different NFL positions:

    Offensive tackle ‚€“ 26
    Center ‚€“ 25
    Quarterback ‚€“ 24
    Guard ‚€“ 23
    Tight end ‚€“ 22
    Safety ‚€“ 19
    Linebacker ‚€“ 19
    Cornerback ‚€“ 18
    Wide receiver ‚€“ 17
    Fullback ‚€“ 17
    Halfback ‚€“ 16

    And here are the present Super Bowl winning quarterbacks currently active in the NFL and their Wonderlic scores:

    Eli Manning 39

    Aaron Rodgers 35

    Tom Brady 33

    Drew Brees 28

    Russell Wilson 28

    Joe Flacco 27

    Ben Roethlisberger 25

    This means the average Super Bowl winning quarterback scored a 30.7. (That’s not counting Brady’s 33 five times or Eli Manning’s 39 twice either. If you did that the average score bumps up to 32.3)

    That’s statistically significant.


    Feel free to take a sample wonderlic: https://footballiqscore.com/
    that avg will go below 30 shortly cause the best qbs these days are dual threat ones and their mostly 28 and lower if lamar wins with his 13 is would accelerate that below 30 score even faster

  7. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by RAIDERMAN818 View Post
    Do you have the same gripe about Burrow ? It's not easy to evaluate QBs, that's true. I don't hold the fact that Tua and Burrow are surrounded by future NFL players and are well coached against them when trying to project how they'll do at the next level. In fact, I think it makes it a little easier to evaluate them. Were they able to use the superior weapons they have and score a ton of points ? Were they difference makers, or did they rely on their teammates to carry the load ?

    I place far more emphasis in looking at the quality of the opponents they're playing, rather than who they're playing with, when trying to assess a QB.

    I think Burrow clearly made a huge difference for LSU. There's no way LSU would have been the scoring machine they were this year with a lesser QB.

    Similarly, the difference that Tua made when he took over for Hurts (remember the championship game against Georgia ?) was quite evident. The dropoff in Bama's offense this year after Tua got hurt was also quite noticeable.

    You're right that moving up to draft Tua is a gamble. The truth is there's no guarantee that anyone we draft in the first round is going to pan out. That's at any position. I don't need to list all our first round disappointments and busts to prove that. It's common knowledge.

    IMO, if he didn't get injured, we'd be looking at a 2020 draft that had Burrow and Tua going 1 and 2.

    Tua's injury might turn out to be a blessing in disguise for us in that we might be able to snag him at a discounted rate, although to be honest I don't see him falling past 3 if his hip checks out.

    We'll see.

    BTW, who is the 'longneck' ? JaMoron ? Think he played for LSU, not Bama. AL did fall in love with him after he won the title. JaMoron's problem wasn't a lack of talent, it was a lack of brains and desire. Don't think Burrow and Tua have the same concerns.
    Long neck is Mike Glennon haha. thought he played at Alabama but he went to NC State.

  8. #88
    Quote Originally Posted by mstrbass2000 View Post
    that avg will go below 30 shortly cause the best qbs these days are dual threat ones and their mostly 28 and lower if lamar wins with his 13 is would accelerate that below 30 score even faster
    It'll take a lot more than Jackson winning the SB once to bring that average down on a significant level. Check out this graph I attached. Since 2010 we've only had 1 QB who scored below 24 start in a super bowl, let alone win a super bowl. That season Cam Newton ran the ball 90 times in 15 games (dual-threat).

    A QB who can't think quickly/process information as quickly as other QB's better be able to run the ball effectively to offset that gap. If he can't do that, we'll see happy feet, panicked behavior, erratic reading of the game, and a lack of ability to go through progressions (sound familiar?). Moreover, this simply translates to what recent history (past decade) has repeatedly shown us, they don't win much. Plenty of fans and analysts alike have pointed out Carr's pathological insistence to check-down, the look on his face when he sees defenders coming at him, how he locks onto one option and never sees other open receivers/outlets, and how he cannot extend plays for the life of him.

    The odds that Derek Carr somehow becomes an outlier or anomaly or exception to the rule are slim to none. Those who ignore history, are doomed to repeat it.



    jhnz8ls69zo01.jpg
    Last edited by DoctorRaider; 01-24-2020 at 10:50 AM.

  9. #89
    Although I'm not a Carr hater, the one thing that has bothered me is he didn't lean from a mistake. Twice sticking his arm into the endzone and fumbling. I'll give you one, but twice isn't acceptable.

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