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Thread: Daniel Jeremiah 2020 mock draft 1.0 - 4 QBs in top 15

  1. #61
    Quote Originally Posted by mstrbass2000 View Post
    "taken from an article on the wonderlic" The truth is this, there is no dispositive test that proves what will make a successful quarterback in the NFL. But the fact that Cam Newton and Derek Carr are the only successful NFL quarterbacks in the league right now with Wonderlic scores below 25 seems like a pretty significant data point to consider if you’re drafting a quarterback.

    Scoring high doesn’t guarantee you’re going to be a Super Bowl winner — hello, Ryan Fitzpatrick — but SCORING LOW does make it significantly more likely that you won’t be one"

    ps add mahomes with 24,add deshaun watson with 20,add kyler murray,add lamar jackson with 13 to the list of current qbs seems like the league is trending toward dumber qbs and

    since the league is moving toward dual threat qbs in a few yrs the wonderlic will mean nothing as that avg score is gonna avg 25 shortly
    “Scoring high doesn’t guarantee you’re going to be a Super Bowl winner — hello, Ryan Fitzpatrick — but scoring low does make it significantly more likely that you won’t be one"

    Ding ding ding

  2. #62
    Quote Originally Posted by mstrbass2000 View Post
    so in the future since dual threat qbs are the trend now the wonderlic is gonna mean crap,that avg score is gonna continue lower as mahomes,lamar,deshaun,kyler and soon tua,burrow,herbert,love all are dual threats as well,since 2017 the wonderlic avg has dropped from 25 threshold to 23 threshold and itll drop a lot more in the coming yrs
    How does this help Derek Carr? He’s not a dual-threat QB

    Do you see Carr evolving into a dual-threat QB?

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorRaider View Post
    “Scoring high doesn’t guarantee you’re going to be a Super Bowl winner — hello, Ryan Fitzpatrick — but scoring low does make it significantly more likely that you won’t be one"

    Ding ding ding
    this is the problem though the new superstar qbs of the future are all below the avg 30 for super bowl qbs and the avg qb of 25 trend for winning qbs is also going lower...wonderlic is obsolete in the future
    Last edited by mstrbass2000; 01-23-2020 at 08:58 AM.

  4. #64
    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorRaider View Post
    How does this help Derek Carr? He’s not a dual-threat QB

    Do you see Carr evolving into a dual-threat QB?
    its proving the point that qbs and wonderlic scores are obsolete,all qb scores and all super bowl winner scores will trend lower as the new crop of superstar qbs all scored lower then 25 wonderlics even if garop wins his score of 28 is still below the 30 avg of previous sb winners if mahomes wins his score of 24 is way below the avg of 30 if lamar wins it his wonderlic of 13 would accelerate the wonderlic argument even further

  5. #65
    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorRaider View Post
    How does this help Derek Carr? He’s not a dual-threat QB

    Do you see Carr evolving into a dual-threat QB?
    nobody argued he was,what my argument was is the wonderlic is obsolete and useless as the scores continue lower as the current crop of great qbs whom scored below 25 on the wonderlic,this also affects the super bowl winners list avg as well,the trend is lower scores

  6. #66
    A QB might ace the Wonderlic and have poor throwing ability. You wind up with a QB that can process information quickly but doesn't have the physical ability to take advantage of his superior mental capacity. In short, you have a guy that can SEE what needs to be done but can't do it.

    Conversely, a QB might do poorly on the Wonderlic but posseses a rocket arm with tremendous accuracy. You wind up with a QB that does not process information quickly and isn't able to effectively utilize his superior throwing ability. In short, you have a guy with the requisite physical ability but who doesn't process info quickly enough to succeed.

    At the NFL level, almost every QB has the raw physical ability. They don't get drafted unless they do.

    The Wonderlic can be used to possibly weed out QBs that aren't bright enough to succeed even though they're physically gifted.

    A 'dual threat' QB still needs to process info quickly, but his running ability allows him to succeed where a conventional pocket passer might not. So his Wonderlic score might not be as relevant or important.

    There's a wide spectrum of possibilities involved. There are a few extremely intelligent QBs. There are a few dummies. Most fall somewhere in between.

    Where does Carrbage fit in ?

    I think he's below average in processing info quickly but has better than average throwing ability or 'arm talent'.

    Of course, even if Carrbage had a perfect Wonderlic score and had the greatest arm talent in the NFL, he'd still FAIL.

    That's because he's missing some things the Wonderlic can't measure -- HEART and BALLS.

    With Carrbage you've got a combination of less than average intelligence, better than average arm talent, and a complete lack of intestinal fortitude.

    Add them all up and what do you get ?

    A MEDIOCRE PUSSY.
    Last edited by RAIDERMAN818; 01-23-2020 at 09:31 AM.

  7. #67
    Quote Originally Posted by mstrbass2000 View Post
    nobody argued he was,what my argument was is the wonderlic is obsolete and useless as the scores continue lower as the current crop of great qbs whom scored below 25 on the wonderlic,this also affects the super bowl winners list avg as well,the trend is lower scores
    It's not obsolete for traditional pocket passers and it's just not as viable as a tool for dual-threat QB's which is why I excluded them from the get-go. The only reason the "average" will come down is because the NFL will likely see more dual-threat QB's making an impact as the league continues to evolve.

    However, I hate to reiterate this but Carr's score cannot be evaluated alongside the scores of dual-threat QB's for obvious reasons. His IQ is well below all of the pocket-passer QB's I mentioned earlier .. Brees, Brady, Jimmy G, Rodgers, Rivers, Mahomes (he can run, but he's a pocket passer), Wilson (can run, but he's a pocket passer), Matt Ryan, Tannehill, Roethlisberger, Wentz, Goff, Prescott, Stafford, Cousins, Foles, Allen the list goes on.

    The most glaring point here is that one can actually see that lack of mental strength/intelligence shine through when evaluating Carr from the moment he snaps the ball until the moment he throws the ball. It's as if he's determined who he's going to throw the ball to before he even snaps the ball; he's consistently locked in on receivers and rarely makes it through his progressions. It goes from option 1 to option 4 (check down) all too often.
    Last edited by DoctorRaider; 01-23-2020 at 09:53 AM.

  8. #68
    Quote Originally Posted by RAIDERMAN818 View Post
    A QB might ace the Wonderlic and have poor throwing ability. You wind up with a QB that can process information quickly but doesn't have the physical ability to take advantage of his superior mental capacity. In short, you have a guy that can SEE what needs to be done but can't do it.

    Conversely, a QB might do poorly on the Wonderlic but posseses a rocket arm with tremendous accuracy. You wind up with a QB that does not process information quickly and isn't able to effectively utilize his superior throwing ability. In short, you have a guy with the requisite physical ability but who doesn't process info quickly enough to succeed.

    At the NFL level, almost every QB has the raw physical ability. They don't get drafted unless they do.

    The Wonderlic can be used to possibly weed out QBs that aren't bright enough to succeed even though they're physically gifted.

    A 'dual threat' QB still needs to process info quickly, but his running ability allows him to succeed where a conventional pocket passer might not. So his Wonderlic score might not be as relevant or important.

    There's a wide spectrum of possibilities involved. There are a few extremely intelligent QBs. There are a few dummies. Most fall somewhere in between.

    Where does Carrbage fit in ?

    I think he's below average in processing info quickly but has better than average throwing ability or 'arm talent'.

    Of course, even if Carrbage had a perfect Wonderlic score and had the greatest arm talent in the NFL, he'd still FAIL.

    That's because he's missing some things the Wonderlic can't measure -- HEART and BALLS.

    With Carrbage you've got a combination of less than average intelligence, better than average arm talent, and a complete lack of intestinal fortitude.

    Add them all up and what do you get ?

    A MEDIOCRE PUSSY.


    This is on point.

  9. #69
    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorRaider View Post
    It's not obsolete for traditional pocket passers and it's just not as viable as a tool for dual-threat QB's which is why I excluded them from the get-go. The only reason the "average" will come down is because the NFL will likely see more dual-threat QB's making an impact as the league continues to evolve.

    However, I hate to reiterate this but Carr's score cannot be evaluated alongside the scores of dual-threat QB's for obvious reasons. His IQ is well below all of the pocket-passer QB's I mentioned earlier .. Brees, Brady, Jimmy G, Rodgers, Rivers, Mahomes (he can run, but he's a pocket passer), Wilson (can run, but he's a pocket passer), Matt Ryan, Tannehill, Roethlisberger, Wentz, Goff, Prescott, Stafford, Cousins, Foles, Allen the list goes on.

    The most glaring point here is that one can actually see that lack of mental strength/intelligence shine through when evaluating Carr from the moment he snaps the ball until the moment he throws the ball. It's as if he's determined who he's going to throw the ball to before he even snaps the ball; he's consistently locked in on receivers and rarely makes it through his progressions. It goes from option 1 to option 4 (check down) all too often.
    STOP witht he traditional and the dual threat bs already,all qbs even the dual threat ones have to be able to process info quickly and a qb is also a qb no matter what the ability,the problem with your argument is dual threat qbs don't have to be quick thinkers or quick info processors,thats simply not the case,even dual threat guys have to recognize and go thru progression before looking to escape all in about 2.5 secs

  10. #70
    Quote Originally Posted by mstrbass2000 View Post
    STOP witht he traditional and the dual threat bs already,all qbs even the dual threat ones have to be able to process info quickly and a qb is also a qb no matter what the ability,the problem with your argument is dual threat qbs don't have to be quick thinkers or quick info processors,thats simply not the case,even dual threat guys have to recognize and go thru progression before looking to escape all in about 2.5 secs
    That's not what I'm saying at all actually. I fully agree with you that dual-threat QB's have to be able to process info quickly as well. The part you're not acknowledging is that a dual-threat QB has the option & ability to make a play with his legs when under pressure, which is a massive advantage that most QB's do not possess. Therefore from a logical standpoint, dual-threat QB's and traditional pocket passers must be evaluated differently, which I'm sure all NFL teams do anyway, with or without the wonderlic score being accounted for.

    Scenario

    Student A: Above average score (30), no calculator use permitted on next exam

    Student B: Below average score (20), no calculator use permitted on next exam

    Student C: Below average score (20), calculator use permitted on next exam

    Which student will perform most poorly on the next exam? Hint, it's Student B

    The advantageous use of a calculator by Student C is similar to the advantage a dual-threat QB has; an asset/tool/weapon that neither student A or B have

    It would be plausible that Student C would elevate his grade beyond a score of 20 on his subsequent exam because he'll have a calculator at his disposal, while Student B's score would remain idle at 20

    Which student's performance could you compare Student B with? Hint, it's Student A
    Last edited by DoctorRaider; 01-23-2020 at 01:02 PM.

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