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Thread: Odell B JR- Are the rumors true?

  1. #41
    Quote Originally Posted by psly2124 View Post
    I get that you are a fan, but because players have a couple of good games doesn't put them into an elite class. They are playing good football not at an elite level. Waller is playing good but you can't say he is better then Ertz or Kelse. Both have performed at a high level for more then 5 games. You cannot put Jacobs into Zeke or Mccafery. Both have put up huge numbers in more then one season.I get that you love Jacobs but he isn't the front runner for ROY. Murray an Mineshaw are the top 2 right now. Qb's have an advantage in ROY votes. A few years ago Dak beat out Zeke. Everyone on the planet knew Zeke was the far superior player and put up better numbers. The o-line is also playing good football but it is not an elite line. Two weeks ago have this message board said the o-line was garbage and the season was over and dump Carr. It's a long season. If Jacobs runs for 1400 and 15 then he will be elite. Those are elite numbers. As for Waller he will need to score TD's to be elite. he has yet to find the end zone. Until then he cannot be elite. 100 catch or 1000 yards can put him into the top 5.
    So Mahomes last year during the season was not an "Elite" QB? I put Jacobs in the same league as Elliot, what the hell has Elliot done this year? In my opinion he has taken a step backwards while Jacobs has gotten better every week and that will continue. Using your logic there is no sense in getting excited about a draft and basically no need to criticize any picks since none of these guys have ever done anything. Waller is a freak, a nighmare for defenses and the only one who can stop him is himself, are defenses all of a sudden going to figure out how to stop him and bring him back down to earth? i don't think so, lets revisit this conversation a year ago and i believe it is safe to say you'll be assessing their talent the same way that others are currently, yes these are ELITE players.

  2. #42
    Quote Originally Posted by psly2124 View Post
    To be an elite line you have to play that way for years not 2 games. Against the Vikings they didn't have a good game and people on this board were calling for cable's head and Miller was a bust. The Eagles o-line has played well for years and so has the Cowboys. The Steelers and Patriots always have a good line. All four have been doing it game in and game out for years.
    Since the Raider OL as constituted in 2019 hasn't been together for years, don't you think it's a bit unreasonable to expect them to have played at an elite level for years ?

    NE's line is anything but elite these days. Pitt's line without Ben extending plays isn't exactly looking elite anymore.

    So that leaves Dallas and Philly. I can make a case that the Raider OL is playing just as well, if not better, than either of those 2, but why bother ? Having one of the top three lines in the NFL is elite enough for me.

    Quote Originally Posted by psly2124 View Post
    I've said for years on this board that paying guards or drafting guards in the first round is a complete waste of a draft pick and a waste of money.
    The Colts will disagree with you about drafting a Guard in the first round and so will Zombie Gene Upshaw.

    You've also said that having a top notch punter is of zero importance, so you'll have to excuse me for taking your assessment of the importance of Guard play with a grain of salt.

  3. #43
    teh guard psoition is very important now that you have attacking 3 techs like donald,jj watt,chris jones these guys can wreck your offense

  4. #44
    Quote Originally Posted by RAIDERMAN818 View Post
    Since the Raider OL as constituted in 2019 hasn't been together for years, don't you think it's a bit unreasonable to expect them to have played at an elite level for years ?

    NE's line is anything but elite these days. Pitt's line without Ben extending plays isn't exactly looking elite anymore.

    So that leaves Dallas and Philly. I can make a case that the Raider OL is playing just as well, if not better, than either of those 2, but why bother ? Having one of the top three lines in the NFL is elite enough for me.



    The Colts will disagree with you about drafting a Guard in the first round and so will Zombie Gene Upshaw.

    You've also said that having a top notch punter is of zero importance, so you'll have to excuse me for taking your assessment of the importance of Guard play with a grain of salt.
    I disagree with the colts. You don't take guards in the first round. Quinton Nelson is a waste. He led the league in penalties last year. The reason why the colts line was improved is because they drafted a tackle in the 2nd roun, Braden Smith and he's played well. It's simple. You don't pay guards 10 million a year. Becuase you can find suitable guards for the league minimum. The Raiders guard play is very good this year. THey didn't spend 20 million or 2 first round picks. They spent the money wisely on a RT and on defense. You are talking in circle. First it's the Raiders o-line is elite because they played back to back good games. And the Patriots and Pittsburgh isn't elite because they played a bad game. And you dont need a top notch punter either. ZERO importance. Even less then a guard.
    Last edited by psly2124; 10-12-2019 at 07:41 PM.

  5. #45
    Quote Originally Posted by Oakr8der View Post
    So Mahomes last year during the season was not an "Elite" QB? I put Jacobs in the same league as Elliot, what the hell has Elliot done this year? In my opinion he has taken a step backwards while Jacobs has gotten better every week and that will continue. Using your logic there is no sense in getting excited about a draft and basically no need to criticize any picks since none of these guys have ever done anything. Waller is a freak, a nighmare for defenses and the only one who can stop him is himself, are defenses all of a sudden going to figure out how to stop him and bring him back down to earth? i don't think so, lets revisit this conversation a year ago and i believe it is safe to say you'll be assessing their talent the same way that others are currently, yes these are ELITE players.
    Mahomes threw for 50 touchdouns. Who said he wasn't an elite QB...not me. Josh Jacobs ran for 100 yards...ONCE. Elliot held out all traing camp and has as many 100 yard games as Jacobs. He's averageing 4.5 yards a carry and 4 td's. How is that taking a step backwards? Jacobs has played 5 games. 5 games. How many touchdowns does the freak Waller have? ZERO. I can't into the simple mind and know what your "logic" is. Nor can I explain "logic" that is wrong. You keeep putting words into my mouth to try and prove something. The definition of "elite" is the best. By definition you say the Raiders have the best TE and the best RB in football. Nobody except a Raider fan would agree with you. Nobody. Last year Jarrod Cook was elite in your mind. You wanted to resign him at any cost. Signing Cook was a stupid move and I said so. So elite cook fell off the planet. He isnt elite anymore. Why is that. Becaue he was never elite. Coud it be the same for Waller. I don't know yet. It's too soon to tell. The Raiders have 1 reciever and are forcing the ball into him, similar to Cook last year. Will Waller put up the same numbers if the Raiders had better receiver. Maybe. We wil find out in a year or two.

  6. #46
    Quote Originally Posted by mstrbass2000 View Post
    teh guard psoition is very important now that you have attacking 3 techs like donald,jj watt,chris jones these guys can wreck your offense
    THe only position on offense that is less valuable is fullback and punter. Guard is a position where failed tackles end up. Failed guards never move to tackle, they just move out of the league. Guard is the last stop for bad lineman.

  7. #47
    Quote Originally Posted by psly2124 View Post
    The definition of "elite" is the best. By definition you say the Raiders have the best TE and the best RB in football.
    Nope. The actual definition of elite is the GROUP or part of a GROUP regarded as the best.

    There's not just one elite QB or TE or RB.

    Saying Waller is an elite TE doesn't mean he's THE best TE. Just means he's part of a GROUP of TE's that are regarded as the best.

    Saying the Raiders have an elite OL is not the same as saying they're the singular best line in the NFL. Just that they're part of a group of the best lines in the NFL.

    That's why Mahomes, Brady, and Brees can all be considered elite.

    They're part of a GROUP that is regarded as the best, not necessarily the singular best.

  8. #48
    Quote Originally Posted by RAIDERMAN818 View Post
    Nope. The actual definition of elite is the GROUP or part of a GROUP regarded as the best.

    There's not just one elite QB or TE or RB.

    Saying Waller is an elite TE doesn't mean he's THE best TE. Just means he's part of a GROUP of TE's that are regarded as the best.

    Saying the Raiders have an elite OL is not the same as saying they're the singular best line in the NFL. Just that they're part of a group of the best lines in the NFL.

    That's why Mahomes, Brady, and Brees can all be considered elite.

    They're part of a GROUP that is regarded as the best, not necessarily the singular best.
    Have you watched every nfl game this year. Doubtful. Because if you haven't you cannot say that other teams o lines haven't been playing well. You are a plagorist, stealing someone elses thought and using it as your own. Unless you watched every Steeler game and every Patriot game. How do you know those offensive lines have not been playing well? Do you just make it up to try an prove a point? You did that with me saying I said things that I didn't. I say you just make it up. Show me something that proves your point? Anything that says the Raiders o line is elite or that they are better then the Eagles and Cowbys. Because after the Viking game PFF rated the Raiders o line at 25. After 2 weeks they are now considered elite. Like I said in an earlier post. They had a good two game stretch. They are not elite.

  9. #49
    I'm not making anything up. I merely corrected you about the true definition of elite.

    Don't like being corrected ? Too bad.

    BTW...what's a 'plagorist' ?

  10. #50
    Some #s to make people appreciate what a HEALTHY Jacobs and OL did vs the best D in football.

    Bears yards given up vs the run by week:
    1, GB: 47
    2, Den: 90
    3, Was: 69
    4, Min: 40
    5, Oak : 169

    And NEXT week will be the 1st week the OL is completely healthy & available!
    Incredible!

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