Huff looking forward to "real" defense w/out Al Davis calling it.

[StickShift]

Looking at the defensive players individually, how come everyone of them regressed in 2011?

Did one player have a better 2011 than 2010?

Tommy Kelly maybe?

This argument started because I stated that Huff's "successful" 2010 season was based off of scheme not because it was his contract year (as stated by another poster). And I stand by that. Marshall's D was not perfect but it did seem to fit to our personnel. Huff, Routt, and Kelly all had their best years as Raiders, Houston had a solid rookie year with 5 sacks. While Kelly put up good numbers in 2011, the others feel off the map.

I don't recall seeing Rolando covering WR's 40 yards downfield in 2010 or Lamarr Houston covering Antonio Gates, or our safeties telegraphing blitzes from 30 yards deep. We went from playing to our personnel's strengths in 2010 to playing to their weaknesses in 2011.

Ask yourself this, would the 2011 defense see improvement off our 2010 season if Marshall and his scheme was brought back?

Would the 2012 defense see improvement off our 2011 season if Corky and his scheme was brought back?

[kinz]

Its happening in slow motion, but this defense is being blown up. In 2 years there will be a handful of guys left from last year, and the playbook will be in the Raiders museum where it belongs. Shaugnessey and Bryant look like keepers, don't think we will overpay to keep Branch, the likes of Kelly, Seymour, McClain, Huff will probably be gone when we can afford to dump their contracts. If Huff really turns it around this year, he might stay, same with Ro, but neither is even a 50-50 bet. Games like the Buffalo and Denver games (and others) are simply unacceptable and call for wholesale changes.

I think we try to compete the next few years, and maybe even scratch out a playoff spot in a weak division. But I think our focus will be on building for a solid team in 3-4 years. We will need a lot of players on defense and a new starting QB (if Pryor doesn't pan out). I think we have something to build on with o-line, wr, some d-line. Hopefully a young db or two will pan out. But this will take a while.

While the short term won't be pretty, we were going nowhere on defense the old way. I see what Huff means.

[rocket625]

From Last in passing and low in rushing to tops with Dennis Allen. Need to stop the revolving door and get the WEST!

[MadBomber24]

My answer is neither. If the DC is given the authority to run what they want then neither Marshall or Bres would be on my list of potential candidates (not that I have a list of potential candidates as the DCs I know are all employed already).

If I had to choose between Marshall and Bresnahan, I'd first ask if they have complete authority. Even though my answer before that question is Marshall, I realize that the answer to that question is (was) the problem and conclude that the numbers will be slightly better or worse, depending on who is chosen.

The players have to take accountability because it's not ALL scheme. While it makes it a bit easier for opposing offenses to run their plays, there were plenty of tackles missed that would've kept drives in check. I remember cursing at Chuck Bresnahan throughout his tenure when Gruden and Callahan were the coaches, but it all came together in a Sunday night game vs. the Seahawks where Shaun Alexander almost broke the single game rushing record. In that game, my "fault needle" swayed from 95% to 60% in favor of Chuckles. I saw players who were out of position, but I also saw players who were in position and still missed.

Before I get excited over this real defense talk, I want to see some real tackles.

[cheapshotartist]

Its happening in slow motion, but this defense is being blown up. In 2 years there will be a handful of guys left from last year, and the playbook will be in the Raiders museum where it belongs. Shaugnessey and Bryant look like keepers, don't think we will overpay to keep Branch, the likes of Kelly, Seymour, McClain, Huff will probably be gone when we can afford to dump their contracts. If Huff really turns it around this year, he might stay, same with Ro, but neither is even a 50-50 bet. Games like the Buffalo and Denver games (and others) are simply unacceptable and call for wholesale changes.

I think we try to compete the next few years, and maybe even scratch out a playoff spot in a weak division. But I think our focus will be on building for a solid team in 3-4 years. We will need a lot of players on defense and a new starting QB (if Pryor doesn't pan out). I think we have something to build on with o-line, wr, some d-line. Hopefully a young db or two will pan out. But this will take a while.

While the short term won't be pretty, we were going nowhere on defense the old way. I see what Huff means.

I agree that we are building for the future the players we currently have are not good enough IMHO scheme or no scheme. The team should play better and we even may make the playoffs with some luck but we still need to get a lot better on the OL, DL, LB, Safety's, WR & RB and also find our QB of the future. CP is a stop gap IMHO.

[regret]

Well, ideally, the defense is constantly being "blown up". You get a handful of good years out of your draft picks and once they're too expensive to retain, you ship them out and bring in new talent. Nothing particularly new or revolutionary about the process except that we haven't seen it here lately. Instead, we've had to overpay to bring in anyone remotely talented. Those days are gone for good.

[kinz]

Well, ideally, the defense is constantly being "blown up". You get a handful of good years out of your draft picks and once they're too expensive to retain, you ship them out and bring in new talent. Nothing particularly new or revolutionary about the process except that we haven't seen it here lately. Instead, we've had to overpay to bring in anyone remotely talented. Those days are gone for good.

I disagree. The Steelers and Ravens every year change the curtains, buy a new sofa, or maybe freshen up the paint. They have things nicely set up, and keep it looking good. Like a nice hotel. We have a flop house we are bulldozing. We might save a couple of trees or other knick knacks, but are really starting fresh.

[TonyHighRoller]

It's all talk right now...

[regret]

I disagree. The Steelers and Ravens every year change the curtains, buy a new sofa, or maybe freshen up the paint. They have things nicely set up, and keep it looking good. Like a nice hotel. We have a flop house we are bulldozing. We might save a couple of trees or other knick knacks, but are really starting fresh.

We can agree to disagree. I think our defense has enough talent on it to be competitive, we've just been running a scheme that makes quarterbacks like Steve Young and Rich Gannon have to try (and fail) to suppress laughter on live television.

[kinz]

We can agree to disagree. I think our defense has enough talent on it to be competitive, we've just been running a scheme that makes quarterbacks like Steve Young and Rich Gannon have to try (and fail) to suppress laughter on live television.

Don't disagree there is some "talent" on defense. But these guys are soft, and have no balls. They are quitters. That is why we have to dump them and start over.

[cheapshotartist]

Don't disagree there is some "talent" on defense. But these guys are soft, and have no balls. They are quitters. That is why we have to dump them and start over.

I agree we have a few guys on defense who need to walk the plank.

[HITMAN]

Some of the guys that AL signed were signed to hurt the OTHER team more than to help the Raiders. It's a copycat league, remember?

Everybody else wanted to be AL. There was a method to his madness.

Al's mantra was to just win baby... hard to win when you have a roster filled with underachievers and over payed primma donnas... If Davis were doing as you suggest then I would surmise he was incapable of running a professional franchise. You put players on your roster to make your team better not make the other team worse... flawed thinking on the part of Davis.

[d-mac37]

The Raiders set franchise worsts last year in touchdown passes allowed (31), yards per carry (5.1), yards passing (4,262) and total yards (6,201), while giving up the third-most points (433) in team history.

[Da Swami]

Don't disagree there is some "talent" on defense. But these guys are soft, and have no balls. They are quitters. That is why we have to dump them and start over.

You're serious aren't you?

Have you ever played on a defense that had no morale?

I think the new scheme will breathe fresh air in to guys who were consistently put in a position to fail year in and year out.

[regret]

You're serious aren't you?

Have you ever played on a defense that had no morale?

I think the new scheme will breathe fresh air in to guys who were consistently put in a position to fail year in and year out.

Indeed. I've played on top teams and absolutely ****ing horrendous teams and the difference in talent wasn't significant between the two extremes. Rather, it was the coaching. Going from a guy who knows his **** backwards and forwards, knows how to use you in his schemes, and gets everyone to buy into it, to some bumbling ****ing idiot who doesn't know anything about anything is a staggering difference. Yeah, if you have any pride whatsoever you still show up and play for that idiot, but you feel kind of helpless to do anything besides bust your ass and pray.

And I'm sorry, if anyone thinks Seymour just showed up to collect a paycheck, they're delusional. His pre-game and halftime speeches are ****ing legendary. You cannot convince me that man did not give a ****, nor can you convince me he's "soft".