Run defense...a problem or not?

[Da Swami]

First thread for me.

Long time Raider fan of 4 decades having grown up in the Monterey bay area.

Long time lurker that finally had enough of the old board I was going to.

This is a great board.

Anyway, I wanted to throw out a few things about our run defense. The draft was supposed to be where we drafted the guy who would shore up our D line and run defense. But Im here to say theres nothing wrong with it and that we did address it this offseason.

Thats what Im saying.

Lets break things down.

In 2006, the Raiders run defense played very well. Oh sure, we were ranked down there but not our average YPC. That was very good. Teams had the luxury of sitting on 2 score leads early in games and ran the ball a lot on us.

But our YPC allowed was low.

The reason that I point this out is because in 2006, we had Warren Sapp playing the 3 technique under tackle and Tommy Kelly playing the 2 gap DT.

We moved Kelly outside and started Sands. In 2007, Sapp was a year older and Sands is not Kelly. Hence, the trade for Gerrard Warren.Last year, we all saw the missed tackles too right? We got no gap penetration from our DTs and our safeties missed tackles all season. Huff was playing SS and Stu was our FS.

The offseason saw us move Kelly to play the 3 technique penetrating DT and we have Warren now with a year in our defense. Warrens play was fine last year and hes a solid 2 gap DT IMO and much better than Sands. We signed Gibril Wilson to play SS and moved Huff to his natural spot at FS where I think he will flourish. Wilson was the leading tackler among safeties the last 2 seasons in the NFL. The Raiders love to run man free and cover 1 packages so the safeties play a huge role in run support. Wilson fills that need very well. We then signed Kalimba Edwards to play DE and now Bill Spires signed. I still think we need help at DE though but I dont think our runn defense is going to be nearly as bad this year and for the reasons I stated above.

Not only that, if th4e additions on offesne add 7 points to every game then teams wont have that luxury of stuffing the ball down our throats. They will be forced to put it up into the strength of our defense which is pass defense.

They wont be doing any running if they are behind late in games.

Let her rip fellas.....

Lets hear it from the peanut gallery.

What does everyone think?

[Gawdzilla]

I agree, in general.

We have some players on the front 7 that we picked up who have already proven that they can play. Edwards, Warren, Spires, etc... and while some of them are not in their prime anymore, they are still capable players. If we just assume that they don't take dives and play up to the level they've shown, I think we can say that we would have a decent defense. If some other key players like Kelly, Sands, or Richardson, step up and have big years, we are capable of having a very good Defense, on par with what we had in '06 or better.

I don't think we are lacking talent on the D.
The real question mark to me is, can Ryan make them all gel?

[BlackHeart]

IMO I feel when a position doesn't have "Star Power" I think some fans won't like the situation. Some fans actually think that you need a pro bowler at every position or something but thats not the case. You need Playmakers, Good players and Decent players I feel

When it comes to this Dline all I see what we really need is a Big run stopper to rotate in and out on downs with the rest of the DTs. Grady Jackson or even a Sam Adams will be just fine for that. Speaking of Sam Adams he isn't even ready to retire and has lost more then 20 pounds last I heard I'm just throwing that out there


People actually think Glenn Dorsey would have made a huge difference in which I disagree with cause drafting him and pairing him with Kelly will just be like having a low level Sapp in which Sapp couldn't even stop the run with Kelly and we've been through that already and we couldn't stop anything.

[XZ.]

Originally Posted by BlackHeart

IMO I feel when a position doesn't have "Star Power" I think some fans won't like the situation. Some fans actually think that you need a pro bowler at every position or something but thats not the case. You need Playmakers, Good players and Decent players I feel

When it comes to this Dline all I see what we really need is a Big run stopper to rotate in and out on downs with the rest of the DTs. Grady Jackson or even a Sam Adams will be just fine for that. Speaking of Sam Adams he isn't even ready to retire and has lost more then 20 pounds last I heard I'm just throwing that out there


People actually think Glenn Dorsey would have made a huge difference in which I disagree with cause drafting him and pairing him with Kelly will just be like having a low level Sapp in which Sapp couldn't even stop the run with Kelly and we've been through that already and we couldn't stop anything.

QFT.

We should be fine, if we can get one big tackle to rotate in there.
See, if we can get Grady, and have him and Kelly inside on first down, give up maybe a yard rushing..same for second down.
3rd and 6 or 7, teams will throw it then. THIS is where Kelly was given all that money for, and where Warren comes in. The penetration can happen and we can actually get a three and out.
I think we're a Grady Jackson-Sam Adams kinda player away from becoming a DECENT run-defense unit. One, that teams will actually throw on, once in a while.

[or24]

Originally Posted by BlackHeart

IMO I feel when a position doesn't have "Star Power" I think some fans won't like the situation. Some fans actually think that you need a pro bowler at every position or something but thats not the case. You need Playmakers, Good players and Decent players I feel

When it comes to this Dline all I see what we really need is a Big run stopper to rotate in and out on downs with the rest of the DTs. Grady Jackson or even a Sam Adams will be just fine for that. Speaking of Sam Adams he isn't even ready to retire and has lost more then 20 pounds last I heard I'm just throwing that out there


People actually think Glenn Dorsey would have made a huge difference in which I disagree with cause drafting him and pairing him with Kelly will just be like having a low level Sapp in which Sapp couldn't even stop the run with Kelly and we've been through that already and we couldn't stop anything.

I agree, Dorsey would be one of the smallest DT's in the league at friggin 297 lbs. I wouldn't like him and 300 lb Kelly playing alongside each other.

[or24]

Originally Posted by XZ.

QFT.

We should be fine, if we can get one big tackle to rotate in there.
See, if we can get Grady, and have him and Kelly inside on first down, give up maybe a yard rushing..same for second down.
3rd and 6 or 7, teams will throw it then. THIS is where Kelly was given all that money for, and where Warren comes in. The penetration can happen and we can actually get a three and out.
I think we're a Grady Jackson-Sam Adams kinda player away from becoming a DECENT run-defense unit. One, that teams will actually throw on, once in a while.

A yard rushing?!?! LOL it's not THAT simple. Other than that good post. We were a horrible run defense last year. Hopefully we can make some progress.

[or24]

I figured the reason our ypc against us were lower in 06 is because our defense knew they were gonna run and were able to slow offenses down a bit. I will be one happy raider fan if we can remotely stop the run. Time will tell

[mysuperx]

Lets not forget that with our offense looking better, we should score more. If we are able to get a lead, it takes away the running game a little, mattering upon the size of the lead. Together, we should be much better against the run this year.

[BlackHeart]

Originally Posted by mysuperx

Lets not forget that with our offense looking better, we should score more. If we are able to get a lead, it takes away the running game a little, mattering upon the size of the lead. Together, we should be much better against the run this year.

uhh yea but remember we have a young and inexperience QB so this offense might be a lil shaky

[hanuma]

I won't repeat all of the arguments I've made about this, but I will say that it's no coincedince at all to me that since Ryan has been our head coach, our Run D has been consistently liable to collapse under pressure. He has to get more out of his players this next season or it's curtains for him. And I don't mean more effort, or more concentration, I mean good coaching and tactics and planning which covers our weaknesses on D and utilises our strengths best. I wonder if Ryan even knows if we have any weak or strong points, every time he's asked everyone is marvellous and they're going to kick arse and if they don't he'll still be in a job.

[RaiderInNY]

It's a problem till proven otherwise. And yes, YOU CAN SAY THAT when the trend since 2003 has been that they have stunk in that department.

[cat444]

First Of All It"s Not Bill Spires But Gregg Spires, Secundo Still Think We Will Have Some Problem Againts The Run, The Better Spot For Kelly Is Not The Dt Spot But The De Spot In 3-4 Defense, When Kelly Arrive In Oakland As Fa Some Years Ago He Was In The Roster Because He Played Very Well At De In 3-4 , Not Su Sur He Will Be A Good Dt , Just Hope. For The Rest Spires And Edwards Are Very Very Bad De Againts The Run, Edward Was Fire By The Lions Because He Was Awful Againts The Run And Spires Is Very Small For A De, He Can Be A Good Back-up For Burgess But Not A Starter De To Play Opposite To Burgess, Also We Sill Need A True Slb , Morrison Is Very Good Inside, Howard Will A Great Fast Wlb Because He Is Very Fast And A Cover Lb , But Slb With Williams And Thomas Are Very Poor.

[Sevendust]

I think Greg Spires is a great addition to take over for the role that Chris Clemons held last year.

Once the Raiders sign Grady Jackson.... we should be a pretty good run defense. Our front seven got a lot better this offseason.

This could be our defensive line on run stopping downs:

DE Tommy Kelly
DT Terdell Sands
DT Grady Jackson
DE Jay Richardson
I think that would be pretty tough to run through!