Oakland Raiders Forum | Message Board - Where the Raider Nation lives!

RaiderDamion · Quote #91 (**permalink**) 04-22-2008, 10:53 AM

damn the next mike mamula

Live.B.A.Raida · Quote #92 (**permalink**) 04-22-2008, 11:01 AM

o wow now we have 2 de's that are almost exactly alike! both can rush the passer, but if they're not getting into the backfield they are invisible!!! and they are starting on opposite ends! here's to a day of giving up 150+ rushing yards!

**OWShaddock** · Quote #93 (**permalink**) 04-22-2008, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RaiderDamion

damn the next mike mamula

Mamula was better than people realize.

It wasn't his fault that:

1. The Eagles drafted him too high.
2. The Eagles misused him (trying to make a 245 to 250-pound guy a three-down DE ... smart).
3. His career was ruined by injuries.

Despite playing out of position and being matched up against guys 75+ pounds bigger than him, he had 22 sacks his first three healthy seasons. I think you'll find that a lot of first-round picks did much worse yet get far less grief.

**Calico Jack** · Quote #94 (**permalink**) 04-22-2008, 11:09 AM

My immediate thought ... we've got a pass rushing demon to bookend with DBurg AND "The QB must go down and go down hard". I would welcome Gholston and hope he is a difference maker for our D.

**OWShaddock** · Quote #95 (**permalink**) 04-22-2008, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Live.B.A.Raida

o wow now we have 2 de's that are almost exactly alike! both can rush the passer, but if they're not getting into the backfield they are invisible!!! and they are starting on opposite ends! here's to a day of giving up 150+ rushing yards!

Didn't the Giants just win the Super Bowl with starting DEs Michael Strahan (6-foot-5, 255) and Usi Umenyiora (6-foot-3, 261)?

Don't the Bears have one of the better pass rushes with DEs that go 255, 260 and 260, respectively?

Besides, last I checked Derrick Burgess doesn't have a lifetime contract. I would hope the Raiders are drafting for the next 10 years, not the next 16 games.

The irony is that some here desperate want the Raiders to draft Darren McFadden despite having two returning 1,000-yard rushers (including one who just got a new contract), as well as a guy with first-round talent waiting for his chance. That's perfectly logical, I guess. Never mind the fact that time and time again it's been proven teams don't need a star running back to won.

But having more than one pass rusher? Both about the same size? Heaven forbid! Lord knows the Raiders don't need help in that category. (sarcasm off)

reggaesand · Quote #96 (**permalink**) 04-22-2008, 11:27 AM

I'd say...Great what the hell am I supposed to do with this silver & black McFadden jersey now?

raider_fan18 · Quote #97 (**permalink**) 04-22-2008, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rdr17

dammit!!!

what he said

**bigjayboogie** · Quote #98 (**permalink**) 04-22-2008, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OWShaddock

Can one of you guys do me a favor?
Once the draft is over, I can borrow one of your crystal balls? I'm geading to the Kentucky Derby and need to know the winner before I place my bets.

Sheesh, people. In the long and storied history of Raiderfans.net, this may be one of the silliest threads ever. Having a favorite is one thing. But some of the things being said about Gholston here are ridiculously wrong.

I'm curious, how many of the "experts" here have ..

1. Broken down coaching film on Gholston? (I'm guessing none of you)

2. Spoken with him to try to understand his character and football IQ? (None?)

3. Scouted him during the season? (None?)

4. Spoken with his coaches at OSU? (Lemme guess ... none?)

I'd venture to guess that all most of you know about Gholston is what you've selectively chosen to believe from what's been written over the past couple months and maybe watched him play once or twice (and by watched him, I don't mean casually viewed an OSU game). Yet based on that, you know for sure who's going to be a bust and who won't.
Sure.

A lot of people who have done a lot more scouting than you or I think Gholston is one of the elite players in the draft and arguably the player with the most upside.
Are they right? I have no idea. But I won't pretend that I know something they don't.

yeah...those people didn't even have him in the top 10 til after his workout...that's why he got tagged a workout warrior...we sure as hell didn't come up with the term. We also didn't come up with the terms: raised his stock....moved up a lotta peoples boards after his workout...yadda yadda. Sorry..burned too many times picking athletes instead of players. #4 pick should be an immediate impact starter...not a d-line who no matter how high people are on him...always mention how he has a questionable motor and takes plays off...last person we drafted like that? Darrell Russell!!!

Live.B.A.Raida · Quote #99 (**permalink**) 04-22-2008, 12:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OWShaddock

Didn't the Giants just win the Super Bowl with starting DEs Michael Strahan (6-foot-5, 255) and Usi Umenyiora (6-foot-3, 261)?

Don't the Bears have one of the better pass rushes with DEs that go 255, 260 and 260, respectively?

Besides, last I checked Derrick Burgess doesn't have a lifetime contract. I would hope the Raiders are drafting for the next 10 years, not the next 16 games.

The irony is that some here desperate want the Raiders to draft Darren McFadden despite having two returning 1,000-yard rushers (including one who just got a new contract), as well as a guy with first-round talent waiting for his chance. That's perfectly logical, I guess. Never mind the fact that time and time again it's been proven teams don't need a star running back to won.

But having more than one pass rusher? Both about the same size? Heaven forbid! Lord knows the Raiders don't need help in that category. (sarcasm off)

Strahan is not just a pass rusher, Strahan is a well rounded de that can also make plays against the run. I'm all for DMac, but if we dont pick him I'm hoping for Long, Dorsey, or Ellis..... just anybody but gholston who brings nothing but a pass rush! we need help against the run.... imo

no I don't think having 2 de's about the same size who offer the same thing (pass rush only) will help much. Why pick Gholston 4 and pay him a lot of $$$$ to bring only a pass rush making hi best suited to be a 3rd down specialist? now if we plan on letting Burgess walk after next year I could see this move, but if we are planning that why not trade Burgess this year and get more picks/players?

**OWShaddock** · Quote #**100** (**permalink**) 04-22-2008, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigjayboogie

yeah...those people didn't even have him in the top 10 til after his workout...that's why he got tagged a workout warrior...we sure as hell didn't come up with the term. We also didn't come up with the terms: raised his stock....moved up a lotta peoples boards after his workout...yadda yadda. Sorry..burned too many times picking athletes instead of players. #4 pick should be an immediate impact starter...not a d-line who no matter how high people are on him...always mention how he has a questionable motor and takes plays off...last person we drafted like that? Darrell Russell!!!

Sorry, Big Jay, but you're wrong.

Mel Kiper had Gholston rated as the 9th best player in the draft before the Combine and had him going to the Jets at #6.

baltimoresun.com - Moving the Chains: Draft profile: Vernon Gholston

Todd McShay had Gholston rated as the 8th best player in the draft before the Combine and had him going to the Jets at #6.

baltimoresun.com - Moving the Chains: Draft profile: Vernon Gholston

Mike Mayock had Gholston rated as the 5th best player in the draft before the Combine.

NFL Network’s Mike Mayock Debuts Top 10 Prospects Heading Into Scouting Combine

Oh ... and Darrell Russell was a great, great football player until he pissed it away on dope. The kid made two Pro Bowls before his 23rd birthday. He was first team All Pro in his second NFL season at the age of 22. Had he stayed clean (and, ultimately, healthy) he could have been an all-time great.

Raiderrooter · Quote #**101** (**permalink**) 04-22-2008, 12:52 PM

I wouldn't scram that at all. I think he'd be a great choice. What I would say is Ryan better get that D to play light's out to make Al lokk good in the decsion to keep him dispite Kiffin's desire to bring in his own man. Personally I do think it will be McFadden. Al can't resist those glamour pick's. In that case I would be very happy with that choice. I guess I'm leaning toward wanting McFadden.

**bigjayboogie** · Quote #**102** (**permalink**) 04-22-2008, 12:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Live.B.A.Raida

Strahan is not just a pass rusher, Strahan is a well rounded de that can also make plays against the run. I'm all for DMac, but if we dont pick him I'm hoping for Long, Dorsey, or Ellis..... just anybody but gholston who brings nothing but a pass rush! we need help against the run.... imo

no I don't think having 2 de's about the same size who offer the same thing (pass rush only) will help much. Why pick Gholston 4 and pay him a lot of $$$$ to bring only a pass rush making hi best suited to be a 3rd down specialist? now if we plan on letting Burgess walk after next year I could see this move, but if we are planning that why not trade Burgess this year and get more picks/players?

not to mention strahan isn't just any de...he's a hall of famer...quite possibly the best ever so comparing him to gholston or burgess isn't appropriate.