Let's Be Honest About Al . . . .

[TheShark]

I have been a Raider fan since the days of Daryl Lamonica. I am second to no one on this site in my loyalty to this team. However, loyalty does not need to be blind. There is nothing sadder than watching a family member ignore all the increasing problems of a loved one and covering up for them, over and over and over and over. I am gonna vent a bit on Big Al. My premise is summed up, in a roundabout way, by starting off with saying this: Hitler's blitzkrieg through Europe was a military masterstroke. The same generals later followed their "genius" into the snowdrifts of Stalingrad when he made the idiotic decision to take on two fronts. Al's "genius" career consisted of: (a) developing the AFL into a rival league, and eventually part of the NFL; (b) turning the Raiders into a super team in the 70's; (c) developing/hiring top coaches such as Madden, Flores, Gruden, and Shanahan; (d) being "player friendly" in an era when owners/coaches were often jerks to the players, and grabbing some old players to get the last top years from them; and (e) winning three Super Bowls. Davis no doubt deserves kudos for all the above. However, I think that over the years, Davis's hubris got so overbearing that he turned into an idiot, though admittedly one who can still make some good calls (the German attempt at the Battle of the Bulge was a masterstroke, even though it ultimately failed and the war was lost). Here are what I consider to be Al's biggest "dumbkopf" moves, and these are just the ones that occur to me: (a) Moving the team to LA, then (after stabbing the locals in the back) blowing his chance to hold a huge market in LA, along with losing 5 bajillion lawsuits against the NFL, and not even honoring season ticket holders from the Bay Area who wanted to buy season tix in LA; (b) getting into ridiculous tiffs with Marcus Allen such that Marcus sat and then went to a bitter division rival ("Marcus" and "JeMarcus" may soon mean the same thing to Al, unfortunately); (c) drafting very poorly in most recent years (not counting this one yet), including collecting armies of DB's to the expense of the rest of the roster; (d) dumping all-star coaches like Gruden and Shanahan; (e) ruining careers of talented players like Porter and Walter by allowing bizarre coaching behavior; and (e) letting talent go (Woodson, Beurlein, etc.); (f) until just recently, not letting his pr/team gear sales people really sell the team. In short, I love the guy, but I have no illusions anymore. He is a cranky, prideful, old dude with a nasty streak a mile long and a willingness to do whatever idiocy pops into his head, and "damn the torpedoes." I really hope this JeMarcus thing does not turn into one of those classic "screw you, you can sit for a year" fisaco's -- but it may. In sum, I just think the Raider Nation needs to realize the last view of their leader may be in the Berlin Bunker, with the bombs falling above. It's high time Al turned this team over to some younger, dedicated folks -- and I sincerely hope he does. I'm not young enough to take this anymore!!!!

[Imasmashu]

Originally Posted by TheShark

I have been a Raider fan since the days of Daryl Lamonica. I am second to no one on this site in my loyalty to this team. However, loyalty does not need to be blind. There is nothing sadder than watching a family member ignore all the increasing problems of a loved one and covering up for them, over and over and over and over. I am gonna vent a bit on Big Al. My premise is summed up, in a roundabout way, by starting off with saying this: Hitler's blitzkrieg through Europe was a military masterstroke. The same generals later followed their "genius" into the snowdrifts of Stalingrad when he made the idiotic decision to take on two fronts. Al's "genius" career consisted of: (a) developing the AFL into a rival league, and eventually part of the NFL; (b) turning the Raiders into a super team in the 70's; (c) developing/hiring top coaches such as Madden, Flores, Gruden, and Shanahan; (d) being "player friendly" in an era when owners/coaches were often jerks to the players, and grabbing some old players to get the last top years from them; and (e) winning three Super Bowls. Davis no doubt deserves kudos for all the above. However, I think that over the years, Davis's hubris got so overbearing that he turned into an idiot, though admittedly one who can still make some good calls (the German attempt at the Battle of the Bulge was a masterstroke, even though it ultimately failed and the war was lost). Here are what I consider to be Al's biggest "dumbkopf" moves, and these are just the ones that occur to me: (a) Moving the team to LA, then (after stabbing the locals in the back) blowing his chance to hold a huge market in LA, along with losing 5 bajillion lawsuits against the NFL, and not even honoring season ticket holders from the Bay Area who wanted to buy season tix in LA; (b) getting into ridiculous tiffs with Marcus Allen such that Marcus sat and then went to a bitter division rival ("Marcus" and "JeMarcus" may soon mean the same thing to Al, unfortunately); (c) drafting very poorly in most recent years (not counting this one yet), including collecting armies of DB's to the expense of the rest of the roster; (d) dumping all-star coaches like Gruden and Shanahan; (e) ruining careers of talented players like Porter and Walter by allowing bizarre coaching behavior; and (e) letting talent go (Woodson, Beurlein, etc.); (f) until just recently, not letting his pr/team gear sales people really sell the team. In short, I love the guy, but I have no illusions anymore. He is a cranky, prideful, old dude with a nasty streak a mile long and a willingness to do whatever idiocy pops into his head, and "damn the torpedoes." I really hope this JeMarcus thing does not turn into one of those classic "screw you, you can sit for a year" fisaco's -- but it may. In sum, I just think the Raider Nation needs to realize the last view of their leader may be in the Berlin Bunker, with the bombs falling above. It's high time Al turned this team over to some younger, dedicated folks -- and I sincerely hope he does. I'm not young enough to take this anymore!!!!

With exception to moving to LA and the Marcus Allen issue, the negatives are opinion based speculation.

You can't compare the "Marcus Allen" issue on Russell's situation because we haven't even had our first preseason game. Also, it was NFL speculation that Russell would sit out the first half, if not the entire first season.

The "drafting poor" may be somewhat valid, but there are two concerns. Number one, the Raiders defense is now reaping the benefits of having a top 5 defense partly due to our most recent DB drafting (Huff, Aso, Washington, etc.). Number two, Al said himself that he wanted Leinart last year, but gave the decision to Shell because he wanted to let his coach have the reigns.

The coaching issue is true also. Davis was all ego and too involved in coaching during Shanahan's short tenure, and this move has fueled a bitter rivalry that continues strong to this day. The Gruden trade was a mistake in some ways, but I don't know what happened behind closed doors between these two. Callahan, Turner and Shell were inept in my opinion, thus the need to bring in a young, energetic coach that would change the entire face of the organization. I think it is popular speculation around the league that Kiffin has done a good job in starting to turn this ship around.

I can't speak for Steve Buerlein, but Woodson was a disappointment for his last 3 seasons with the Raiders. He was consistently injured and seemingly unhappy with his contract and/or money situation in Oakland. The Raiders paid him top dollar in 2005 and he got injured again. Many fans on this site wanted to see him gone.

I can see your points about his attitude, but I think it is obvious he wants to win and will do so at almost any cost. NFL reports state approx. 31 million dollars guaranteed for Russell and Davis told us that money was not the issue. Also, he is a "heavyweight" in the NFL and seems to me to be sensible when he speaks. When we see the guy, he's facing a bunch of reporters, whom he usually knows by first and last name. These are the same reporters that hate the Raiders for the sake of a headline.

I don't know much about the Raiders gear issue, but I know Davis' team, specifically Amy Trask, was instrumental in getting licenses removed from seating at the Colliseum, which lowered ticket costs.

I'm really impressed with how Davis has handed the "coaching reigns" to Kiffin this season. And I'm optimistic based upon what Kiffin's staff has done in the NFL in the past and what they've done with the Raiders' offseason.

Much respect to you, but I agree to disagree on most of your post.

[the_new_Jerry]

why all the debate about AL lately when I personally feel as a fan that this is the best 'offseason' we have had in sometime...

of course we do not know for sure how it will work out in the end...

but I think AL is in the process of proving something...

why cant we just try to be positive for once?

dont we have enough people outside of the nation being negative about us?

[Hawaiian Raider]

Hmm? A little bit confusing thread. But, I gotta agree with the NJ ^, we seem to be having a nice off-season, and nothing but positive waves should be generated.

Positive Waves Raidies and Gents, Positive Waves!

[the_new_Jerry]

word.

[Calico Jack]

Originally Posted by TheShark

I have been a Raider fan since the days of Daryl Lamonica. I am second to no one on this site in my loyalty to this team. However, loyalty does not need to be blind. There is nothing sadder than watching a family member ignore all the increasing problems of a loved one and covering up for them, over and over and over and over. I am gonna vent a bit on Big Al. My premise is summed up, in a roundabout way, by starting off with saying this: Hitler's blitzkrieg through Europe was a military masterstroke. The same generals later followed their "genius" into the snowdrifts of Stalingrad when he made the idiotic decision to take on two fronts. Al's "genius" career consisted of: (a) developing the AFL into a rival league, and eventually part of the NFL; (b) turning the Raiders into a super team in the 70's; (c) developing/hiring top coaches such as Madden, Flores, Gruden, and Shanahan; (d) being "player friendly" in an era when owners/coaches were often jerks to the players, and grabbing some old players to get the last top years from them; and (e) winning three Super Bowls. Davis no doubt deserves kudos for all the above. However, I think that over the years, Davis's hubris got so overbearing that he turned into an idiot, though admittedly one who can still make some good calls (the German attempt at the Battle of the Bulge was a masterstroke, even though it ultimately failed and the war was lost). Here are what I consider to be Al's biggest "dumbkopf" moves, and these are just the ones that occur to me: (a) Moving the team to LA, then (after stabbing the locals in the back) blowing his chance to hold a huge market in LA, along with losing 5 bajillion lawsuits against the NFL, and not even honoring season ticket holders from the Bay Area who wanted to buy season tix in LA; (b) getting into ridiculous tiffs with Marcus Allen such that Marcus sat and then went to a bitter division rival ("Marcus" and "JeMarcus" may soon mean the same thing to Al, unfortunately); (c) drafting very poorly in most recent years (not counting this one yet), including collecting armies of DB's to the expense of the rest of the roster; (d) dumping all-star coaches like Gruden and Shanahan; (e) ruining careers of talented players like Porter and Walter by allowing bizarre coaching behavior; and (e) letting talent go (Woodson, Beurlein, etc.); (f) until just recently, not letting his pr/team gear sales people really sell the team. In short, I love the guy, but I have no illusions anymore. He is a cranky, prideful, old dude with a nasty streak a mile long and a willingness to do whatever idiocy pops into his head, and "damn the torpedoes." I really hope this JeMarcus thing does not turn into one of those classic "screw you, you can sit for a year" fisaco's -- but it may. In sum, I just think the Raider Nation needs to realize the last view of their leader may be in the Berlin Bunker, with the bombs falling above. It's high time Al turned this team over to some younger, dedicated folks -- and I sincerely hope he does. I'm not young enough to take this anymore!!!!

I will cut to the chase. You are entitled to your opinion but the last part that I put in bold, I have 1 question for you ... don't you think to a large extent, Al has done exactly what you asked for by giving Kiffin the authority and free reign to be the steward of the Raiders' fortunes?

[raiderman209]

Is this post still here if Jamarcus was in camp on time....I don't think so.

[RaiderTantrum]

You left out one thing...He rehired Art Shell...worst decision ever

[MaddenRaider]

Originally Posted by the_new_Jerry

why all the debate about AL lately when I personally feel as a fan that this is the best 'offseason' we have had in sometime...

That's true.

But we've been here, before.

Either Kiffin will win, or he'll be a bust. That's the easy part. But if he wins? He'll want more money. He'll want more control. Other teams will be willing to give him that. Will Al match them, in regards to both salary and control? Or will it be another Gruden fiasco? How much could Al have possibly changed, in this regard?

But, you're right. We're in a good position right now. So, let's just savor the moment. But, with Al, a huge dark cloud always looms. And, it's not a silver and black one. It's just a dark cloud, like overcast. LOL.

[MaddenRaider]

Originally Posted by Calico Jack

Al has done exactly what you asked for by giving Kiffin the authority and free reign to be the steward of the Raiders' fortunes?

There is no possible way to determine at this point rather or not Al has given Kiffin authority and free reign.

[_gg_]

TheShark....

The thing is tho, you're looking at it like ALL of Al's best came at the beginning and it's been nothing but a slide and mistakes since.

There have been rocky roads inbetween the halcyon days, and there've been SOME very successful campaigns after our last SB win to the current day. A bit more problems than before, but not an entire cataclysm.

Al is smart, and therefore he knows and acknowledges his flaws/mistakes. No one would know more than him his regrets and failings.

Also consider that due to recent slides, Al has had it tougher hiring players and coaches and staff. So he's had to use band-aid measures (which he is well aware of) over the last four years.

However, the Kiffin signing etc, shows that if you give Al a level playing field, he'll rise to the occasion, and out-perform many other franchises. Level playing field means ability to sign and convince players and coaches to come play. Kiffin, Cable, Knapp, etc, the draft we had, and the apparent professionalism shown, therefore creates a little buzz for players all around the NFL to WANT TO come play. Culpepper taking less dollars. Darius coming on board. Newberry. Williams (and wanting to actually contribute this time in a happier environment). Etc.

1-3 years we'll have another SB in our trophy case.

[MaddenRaider]

Originally Posted by g.g.

TheShark....

The thing is tho, you're looking at it like ALL of Al's best came at the beginning and it's been nothing but a slide and mistakes since.

There have been rocky roads inbetween the halcyon days, and there've been SOME very successful campaigns after our last SB win to the current day.

Nobody disputes that.

But how those campaigns ended, and how they didn't have to, are still a concern to this day.

Al is smart, and therefore he knows and acknowledges his flaws/mistakes. No one would know more than him his regrets and failings.

With all due respect, this view is no more provable than one suggesting that Davis has lost his mind, etc.

Also consider that due to recent slides, Al has had it tougher hiring players and coaches and staff. So he's had to use band-aid measures (which he is well aware of) over the last four years.

Those "slides" are what people are concerned about. And, it's not "slides". It's a slide. Singular. Davis' dealing with Gruden after the 2000 season has pretty much blacklisted him amongst coaching prospects. Kiffin is a clever find, but he was never anyone's first choice. He's very, very young. In a day and age where 30 is the new 20. I like Kiffin, thus far. But we've got a long, long way to go before we can even say he's as good as Gruden.

However, the Kiffin signing etc, shows that if you give Al a level playing field, he'll rise to the occasion,

I don't understand that. What do you mean by "level playing field"? Who gives the level playing field, and how has Al not had one?